Re: Game Discussion

by **Ser Alfred Haigh** Tue Mar 07, 2017 8:27 am

Daenerys would be the cheap way out for me, especially as it would add yet another layer of 'rightfulness' to someone that at least the series pushes to a degree that I find somewhat galling. But knowing the series, it might be the way it happens because viewers.

by **Gwyneth Drakeson** Tue Mar 07, 2017 1:55 pm

Well, it wouldn't be because viewers in this case...it would have to come from Martin's plans for the books.

But I agree that Dany is too much the 'easy' choice. I'd be rather shocked if everything was as cut and dry and simple as that. It would be very counter to how the stories were written up until now.

by **Valar Dohaeris** Tue Mar 07, 2017 3:42 pm

I like the ambiguity, and hope it never gets 'answered' officially.

by **Ser Alfred Haigh** Tue Mar 07, 2017 4:43 pm

Yes, my ideal end of the story would be a mildly tragic one that brings the stories of Jaime/Cersei and Daenerys/Ser Jorah full circle. However, with the amount of episodes left and the hints in the last season, I'll stay sceptic.

Perhaps the books have some nice surprises though. After all, several characters that died in the series are still alive there.

by **Theomore Tullison** Tue Mar 07, 2017 5:30 pm

The series is an alternative universe that I refuse to acknowledge the existence of until I have read the last book.

by **Valar Dohaeris** Tue Mar 07, 2017 6:28 pm

Yeah, I was okay with the minor deviations early in the series (eg Robb's wife, early reveal of Theon storyline, removal of numerous minor characters/side stories) as many were for practical reasons due to the limitations of television vs. books.

This last season went way beyond that in deviating from the books. Still, to a large extent it is GRRMs fault for failing to produce Winds of Winter on schedule. It was always in the contract that HBO would start to make stuff up if they didn't have canon material to work from.

I fear another Wheel of Time scenario.

by **Loreia** Tue Mar 07, 2017 10:34 pm

My main sticking points, and I haven't read the books but I know of a few things that are different...

Tyrion Season 4, Others Season 6:

It should be exciting to watch it wrap up though.

by **Ser Walton Dulver** Mon Mar 13, 2017 9:34 am

What happened with offseason events? I mean for example Coldbrook's Grand Melee?

by **Ser Alfred Haigh** Mon Mar 13, 2017 1:06 pm

I think they're on the backseat to the Kings Landing/Stepstones events, but not entirely disregarded, VD said something along the lines of that, iirc.

by **Valar Dohaeris** Mon Mar 13, 2017 3:06 pm

Indeed.

Certain off-season/Phase I events will probably need Reader's input, but things like the Coldbrook Tourney just need time, attention, and either some convoluted judgement calls or a whole mess of die rolls to get back on track.

Oh, and 'V' or 'Valar' please. 'VD' (in English at least) has some unfortunate other associations that I would prefer not to be identified with.
My own fault for not thinking about acronyms when I picked a name. Embarassed

I could change the name completely, but that could get confusing so I'd rather not.

by **Theomore Tullison** Mon Mar 13, 2017 3:56 pm

Now I can't get a certain image out of my head scratch

by **Valar Dohaeris** Mon Mar 13, 2017 5:52 pm

As this is a family-friendly forum (or at least more so than the books or show), thank you for not sharing.

Also, sorry.

by **Reader** Tue Mar 14, 2017 10:44 pm

Valar Dohaeris wrote:Indeed.

Certain off-season/Phase I events will probably need Reader's input, but things like the Coldbrook Tourney just need time, attention, and either some convoluted judgement calls or a whole mess of die rolls to get back on track.

I'll get round to that at some point. Embarassed

Glorious previews for Doomtown & playtesting (plus playtest reports!) occupying my time at the moment:

https://www.facebook.com/pineboxentertainment/posts/642134415995018

by **Valar Dohaeris** Wed Apr 19, 2017 5:34 pm

I have some bad news.
First: We just lost another player, because of low engagement and the almost total lack of RP.
Second: I have been in touch with Reader, who is unlikely to be able to return in the near future.

I've tried to keep this game moving, but let's be honest here - the events and such are just a framework, the bones of the game. The real substance is the interactions between characters, and that has been largely missing.

Here are a few charts out of the statistics part of the admin panel:

As you can see, there was a brief flurry of activity in November and December - that was the relaunch and launch of Story 3. Reader made his announcement of another hiatus in early January - but event though the game has continued, we are at about the same level of activity as during the hiatus.

The question now is: do we keep the game going, on life support as it were, hoping (and hopefully working) for a revival?
Or do we bring it to an end, telling grand stories of secrets and future plans?

If we choose the latter, Reader can come back later in the year to help wrap up the individual stories.

by **Theomore Tullison** Wed Apr 19, 2017 5:49 pm

I have difficulty seeing revival happening without more players and activity, and I don't see that happening without reasons for them to come, feels kinda like we are lacking those things.

Next game should have four houses, tops.

by **Jon Templeton** Wed Apr 19, 2017 8:54 pm

If we're being candid it'd be better to end it rather than limp along on life support. I think the abrupt exodus of a large number of players was the fatal blow and it seems there aren't enough players to adequately represent the number of houses.

by **Theomore Tullison** Fri Apr 21, 2017 1:10 pm

Some peeps appears interested in keeping it going, I told one of them that such opinion should be uttered here.

But I have to say that this requires agency, everyone needs to attempt to set some sort of IC in motion. Right now we have four guys in KL and four at SS, which is good enough if everyone can at least be active in one non-event thread of some sort involving other PC's, preferably more. Personally, I think it could be fun to do something between Theo and all the other PC's, not all in the same thread perhaps, and I'm not really able to maintain a presence in half a dozen such threads at once. The event threads are just there to keep in touch with the overarching plots.

And what's the point in trying to get people to bother come here if there isn't anything worth reading and responding to?

by **Valar Dohaeris** Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:22 pm

Very true. I know there are OOC discussions about the new KL events... no reason those can't be IC discussions.

by **Loreia** Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:02 pm

I'm going to get an RP thread up with Theomore (us only) later today. I hope seeing some activity will inspire others to start RP threads as well.

I find Triston's impress-to-marry situation compelling, something worth digging into. Because Jon has a high regard for Theomore, we could get contentious over the tenuous strain between House Coldbrook and House Tullison (doesn't have to be the only thing we talk about).

On Loreia, the most obvious ice breaker regarding a "meet-and-greet" with her are the recent political waves she's been making.

by **Theomore Tullison** Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:22 pm

We need some talking points and PC's talking about them. Like the Mushroom event, but not quite sure what might bring it about.

by **Daveth Coldbrook** Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:21 pm

First, I would like to say that what this game has accomplished, compared to the success rate of every single other online game I've played in, has been nothing short of phenomenal. It's length, complexity, and adaptability have been truly a sight to behold.

Secondly, I don't intend to leave. I was here at the beginning, I intend to see it through to the end, whenever that may be.

However, personally, I do lack engagement at the moment, due primarily to out of game reasons resulting in a lack of attention span and focus (though the loss of a high proportion of the out-of-house PCs Daveth had a positive relationship with certainly didn't help).

Also, while it would be wrong to say that his story is over, Daveth has definitely achieved I would say the end of a character arc. When he started, he was a nervous, insecure scholar who frequently was his own worst enemy, torn up by grief and rage, and had a very polite power struggle going on with his brother over who would be heir. Now, he's much more confident, he's managed to more-or-less deal with his grief, he managed to marry a woman who compliments him well, and he managed to settle matters with his brother to his own satisfaction, making him the well-married lord of a banner house, House Snowbrook. In short, all the loose ends at the start of the game have been tied up to my satisfaction.

So, for me personally, bringing it to and end now would be better. Give it a 'proper' ending (even if it's not the ending we'd like to have), rather than fading away into silence.

by **Ayleth Bartheld** Sat Apr 22, 2017 8:14 am

I'd like to keep going.

I've just been having a little trouble where to post, since Ayleth tended to leave final decisions to her husband and he's disappeared.

by **Reader** Sat Apr 22, 2017 8:56 am

I'm certainly available for wrapping up stories with a combination of mechanics, decision making and roleplay if that's the route people want to go down. Smile

Could give everyone a few key personal scenes to show their impact on the civil war and subsequent rebuilding, chances at a glorious death etc.

Soon I'll be away in South Africa for two weeks (wife is a bridesmaid at the wedding) but will be back from the 9th of May.

by **Theomore Tullison** Sat Apr 22, 2017 10:04 am

Ayleth Bartheld wrote:I'd like to keep going.

I've just been having a little trouble where to post, since Ayleth tended to leave final decisions to her husband and he's disappeared.

I say just play Ayleth the way you find it interesting. Just because Davain's player is AWOL doesn't mean that his character has vanished and isn't doing anything at all. I think most places where this has happened, other players have been calling the shots OOC and assumed that the lord character made the decisions.

by **Valar Dohaeris** Sat Apr 22, 2017 5:27 pm

Daveth Coldbrook wrote:First, I would like to say that what this game has accomplished, compared to the success rate of every single other online game I've played in, has been nothing short of phenomenal. It's length, complexity, and adaptability have been truly a sight to behold.

Secondly, I don't intend to leave. I was here at the beginning, I intend to see it through to the end, whenever that may be.

<snip>

So, for me personally, bringing it to and end now would be better. Give it a 'proper' ending (even if it's not the ending we'd like to have), rather than fading away into silence.

I completely agree with those three statements. This game has been absolutely amazing, and I'd love to see it thrive either in it's current incarnation or rising like a phoenix from it's own ashes some time in the future. I just know I can't do either one on my own, and I don't know if even all 8-10 of us still posting can do it.

I'm not giving up, though - I'll keep things moving as best I can for as long as I can if that's what we decide. There are story elements I set up (as a player) I would love to see come to fruition, and I have plenty of interest in seeing the Phase 3 events continue to play out, though I am finding myself having to rework them all for a smaller number of players and houses (not to mention the massive disparity between Green and Black representation). I do feel a bit like a necromancer or puppeteer, though - giving the game the appearance of life but not life itself.

So, again, like Daveth, I think it might be better to end it sooner rather than later - go out with a bang and not a whimper. However I've always been a believer that this wasn't Reader's game and it's not my game now - it's all of ours.

Ayleth Bartheld wrote:I've just been having a little trouble where to post, since Ayleth tended to leave final decisions to her husband and he's disappeared.

Theomore Tullison wrote:I say just play Ayleth the way you find it interesting. Just because Davain's player is AWOL doesn't mean that his character has vanished and isn't doing anything at all. I think most places where this has happened, other players have been calling the shots OOC and assumed that the lord character made the decisions.

Theo's got the right of it. If you need some guidance, I can certainly help - but for the most part, the decisions are yours, even if they are done in Davain's name.

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